Marco Hogewoning - 23-11-2021 16:00:01
Hi everyone, I'm Marco from the RIPE NCC. This chat panel is meant for discussion ONLY. If you have questions for the speaker and you want the session chair to read it out, please write it in the Q&A window also stating your affiliation. Otherwise, you can ask questions using the microphone icon. Please note that all chat transcripts will be archived and made available to the public on https://ripe83.ripe.net/.
Kurt Kayser - 23-11-2021 16:00:03
:left_speech_bubble: works
Niall O'Reilly - 23-11-2021 16:00:19
@PeterH: way to go!
Peter Hessler - 23-11-2021 16:00:52
video conferencing, still difficult after all of this time :(
Christoph Berkemeier - 23-11-2021 16:01:29
There should be a lock in front of the URL @Julf
Achilleas Kemos - 23-11-2021 16:02:13
Thanks Christoph !
Jim Reid - 23-11-2021 16:05:14
+1 for Julf and Achilleas
Brian Nisbet - 23-11-2021 16:05:16
:clap::clap::clap::clap::clap:
Chris Buckridge - 23-11-2021 16:05:37
:clap::clap::clap::clap:
Alexander Isavnin - 23-11-2021 16:05:55
*showing support*
Niall O'Reilly - 23-11-2021 16:06:22
:clap::clap::clap::clap:
Mirjam Kühne - 23-11-2021 16:06:58
👍🏻
Michele Neylon - 23-11-2021 16:08:24
NetMundial - now that's a throwback
Desiree Miloshevic - 23-11-2021 16:11:22
to remind everyone of lab's article on Principles, they are here:
Desiree Miloshevic - 23-11-2021 16:11:24
https://labs.ripe.net/author/chrisb/a-matter-of-principle/
Alexander Isavnin - 23-11-2021 16:15:23
UKNOF48?
Desiree Miloshevic - 23-11-2021 16:16:25
Aexander if you have a question please type it in the Q&A chat
Aaron Hughes - 23-11-2021 16:17:26
Desiree: I believe he is just pointing out that the footer should read RIPE83 :)
Aaron Hughes - 23-11-2021 16:17:41
But this is awesome and long overdue. Glad Chris is presenting this.
Marco Hogewoning - 23-11-2021 16:18:14
probably, but yes some of this was presented at UKNOF last week
Desiree Miloshevic - 23-11-2021 16:18:31
Aaron - yes there was a single slide marked with it, but I am encouraging folks to type in their Qs if any :)
Aaron Hughes - 23-11-2021 16:18:41
:)
Marco Hogewoning - 23-11-2021 16:19:04
and indeed, feel free to drop questions in the Q&A here or come back to list or the Labs article
Michele Neylon - 23-11-2021 16:19:29
yes you do
Michele Neylon - 23-11-2021 16:19:32
*cough*
Michele Neylon - 23-11-2021 16:20:52
when was that report??
Alexander Isavnin - 23-11-2021 16:21:08
Autumn 2018
Aaron Hughes - 23-11-2021 16:21:17
https://www.ripe.net/publications/docs/ripe-723
Chris Buckridge - 23-11-2021 16:21:22
there's a link in the Labs article
Aaron Hughes - 23-11-2021 16:21:25
^ that's the report
Michele Neylon - 23-11-2021 16:21:39
oh - saying it's accountable only to itself is a problem without context
Aaron Hughes - 23-11-2021 16:21:44
Or at least I believe it is
Alexander Isavnin - 23-11-2021 16:21:53
IP networking, not “addressing” AFAIK
Michele Neylon - 23-11-2021 16:22:17
Aaron - thanks
Chris Buckridge - 23-11-2021 16:22:25
thanks Alexander - true
Peter Koch - 23-11-2021 16:23:12
these suggestions appear to mix principles, values, purpose, mission - and policy details; good starting points, but 'problem statement' would be good
Chris Buckridge - 23-11-2021 16:23:43
thanks Peter - I take the point
Aaron Hughes - 23-11-2021 16:24:34
Thanks Chris! Really happy to see this presented.
Francis Nyaga - 23-11-2021 16:24:54
I habe lost the voice, changed device still no voice
Peter Koch - 23-11-2021 16:25:05
sure, good point in time to revisit this
Tom Hill - 23-11-2021 16:25:09
@Chris any chance of a PDF exported from the .key? :)
Alexander Isavnin - 23-11-2021 16:25:31
i would like to respond to Leo Vegoda: that eas discussed during Accountability TF, i hope there is explanation why it’s worded like this in mailinglist and TF presentations
Tom Hill - 23-11-2021 16:25:35
Office is really rather rude about keynote files
Peter Hessler - 23-11-2021 16:25:36
@Tom I see both the .key and the .pdf on the meeting plan
Desiree Miloshevic - 23-11-2021 16:25:53
Let's take this discussion to the mailing list and follow up there
Marco Hogewoning - 23-11-2021 16:25:54
@Francis if you have spatialchat, some techies are available there
Tom Hill - 23-11-2021 16:26:04
Oh! I hadn't refreshed in a while. Thanks @Peter
Brian Nisbet - 23-11-2021 16:26:08
Yeah, I should have opened with the fact this is a really interesting presentation/idea, Chris, thank you!
Marco Hogewoning - 23-11-2021 16:26:22
or ping them via private chat here, they can help troubleshoot
Blake Willis - 23-11-2021 16:26:30
"works on my laptop, what's the problem?"
Florian Streibelt - 23-11-2021 16:26:34
I only have a black square
Florian Streibelt - 23-11-2021 16:26:36
no presentaion
Peter Koch - 23-11-2021 16:26:37
@Tom, that was incidental help ;-)
Aaron Hughes - 23-11-2021 16:26:38
Personally I only see a black squre
Peter Hessler - 23-11-2021 16:26:40
we only see a black square
Brett Carr - 23-11-2021 16:26:43
black square over the ppt
Michele Neylon - 23-11-2021 16:26:44
same
Tom Hill - 23-11-2021 16:26:48
That's another app in front of the presentation
Markus Aberham - 23-11-2021 16:26:48
same !!!
Tahar Schaa - 23-11-2021 16:27:02
we can't see your slides
Raymond Jetten - 23-11-2021 16:27:05
its the darkness of the regulations
Marco Hogewoning - 23-11-2021 16:27:08
exacxtly
Michele Neylon - 23-11-2021 16:27:11
https://ripe83.ripe.net/wp-content/uploads/presentations/50-RIPE-83-Cooperation-NIS-2.pdf
Florian Streibelt - 23-11-2021 16:27:24
I think it was not the poresentation windo being shared but the main window
Christoph Berkemeier - 23-11-2021 16:27:34
+1
Tahar Schaa - 23-11-2021 16:27:37
reshare
Florian Streibelt - 23-11-2021 16:27:53
first start the presentation, then share
Constanze Buerger - 23-11-2021 16:27:57
presentation mode on?
Michele Neylon - 23-11-2021 16:27:59
the PDF is the same slides AFAIK
Desiree Miloshevic - 23-11-2021 16:28:31
thanks Michele it is
Michele Neylon - 23-11-2021 16:29:33
My understanding is that NIS2 removes a lot of the thresholds that were in NIS1
Michele Neylon - 23-11-2021 16:29:45
so we're all screwed (mostly)
Marco Hogewoning - 23-11-2021 16:30:38
If you own/operate a DNS server, there is little place to find exemptions in the original proposal
Michele Neylon - 23-11-2021 16:31:00
the current language gives an exemption for personal DNS
Marco d'Itri - 23-11-2021 16:31:14
What about small unimportant IXPs? :-)
Michele Neylon - 23-11-2021 16:31:31
define "small"?
Tahar Schaa - 23-11-2021 16:31:41
Clear Link please
Peter Hessler - 23-11-2021 16:31:58
I look forward to ams-ix/de-cix claiming they are small and unimportant to get out of these requirements
Marco d'Itri - 23-11-2021 16:32:02
small enough that currently the local government does not care about them
Desiree Miloshevic - 23-11-2021 16:32:09
https://labs.ripe.net/author/suzanne_taylor_muzzin/nis-2-and-the-other-eu-regulation-updates-you-need-to-know-november-2021/
Brett Carr - 23-11-2021 16:32:09
why just non eu root server ops and not non eu TLD Operators
Peter Koch - 23-11-2021 16:32:24
@Michele: a defintion of everything https://ec.europa.eu/growth/smes/sme-definition_en
Tahar Schaa - 23-11-2021 16:32:35
thanks
Ruediger Volk - 23-11-2021 16:32:48
so under NIS2 networks are neither essential nor important? :-)
Michele Neylon - 23-11-2021 16:32:59
Peter - that won't help - if you're an SME and you run critical infrastructure you're caught
Radu-Adrian Feurdean - 23-11-2021 16:33:08
... and how about "Authoritative name servers" ?
Andrei Robachevsky - 23-11-2021 16:33:09
As I understand the most recent proposal does not contain root servers anymore (fortunately!)
Marco d'Itri - 23-11-2021 16:33:24
well... IXPs should never be essential, by definition
Peter Koch - 23-11-2021 16:33:29
@Michele "only" DNS, cf. Article 2
Brett Carr - 23-11-2021 16:33:31
@andrei but still includes TLD Operators
Marco Hogewoning - 23-11-2021 16:33:55
@brett if you have question for the speaker, please post them in Q&A or wait until the end of the talk and request A/V to ask it in person
Andrei Robachevsky - 23-11-2021 16:33:56
@Brett, indeed :(, and not only EU ones
Brett Carr - 23-11-2021 16:34:17
@brett yes indeed .uk :)
Tom Hill - 23-11-2021 16:35:03
That was an incredibly useful slide
Radu-Adrian Feurdean - 23-11-2021 16:35:17
as for IXPs, ask "major" operators, most of them will agree IXP are totally non-essential.....
Marco Hogewoning - 23-11-2021 16:35:18
Thanks Tom
Jim Reid - 23-11-2021 16:35:18
Brett, UK might well c&p NIS2 into UK law.
Tom Hill - 23-11-2021 16:35:42
Marco, did you make it? Good job
Tom Hill - 23-11-2021 16:35:47
Explained the process very clearly
Brett Carr - 23-11-2021 16:35:59
@marco it was a rhetorical question but thanks. I think the NCC has skin in the Root Server ops game but not TLD so makes sense
Andrei Robachevsky - 23-11-2021 16:36:02
I wonder about .tv views on NIS2
Marco Hogewoning - 23-11-2021 16:36:24
@Tom team effort! I'll really to them
Marco Hogewoning - 23-11-2021 16:36:30
relay
Tom Hill - 23-11-2021 16:36:42
:)
Jim Reid - 23-11-2021 16:37:21
Great work here by the NCC team! Keep it up. :-)
Peter Koch - 23-11-2021 16:37:21
hmm, an arbitrary threshold lis actually going to _reduce_ the resilience ...
Tahar Schaa - 23-11-2021 16:37:34
RIPE community has to act much more on the political level to prevent such unqualified regulation! If we're not become a political stakeholder, we will face unqualified regulations all the time in the future! This is a core challange for the RIPE NCC and the RIPE community, my opinion
Marco Hogewoning - 23-11-2021 16:37:43
@brett we have many issues with NIS 2 original, but in root we're relatively unique so we went on that a bit more explicitly
Michele Neylon - 23-11-2021 16:38:15
Article 23 is a nightmare
Peter Koch - 23-11-2021 16:38:46
@Michele: not, if you are an IP lawyer (pun intended)
Michele Neylon - 23-11-2021 16:39:07
Peter - yeah it's like Christmas and Easter all coming together
Christoph Berkemeier - 23-11-2021 16:39:27
Thank you very much for your work and this work.
Kurt Kayser - 23-11-2021 16:39:30
:clap::clap::clap::clap:
Maria Häll - 23-11-2021 16:39:37
Thx a Lot for the presentation!!
Erik Steiger - 23-11-2021 16:39:46
:clap::clap::clap::clap:
Desiree Miloshevic - 23-11-2021 16:43:59
Anriette referred to Chris's article - why do we need IGF here: https://labs.ripe.net/author/chrisb/do-we-need-the-igf-now-more-than-ever/
Kurt Kayser - 23-11-2021 16:50:20
:clap::clap::clap::clap:
Alexander Isavnin - 23-11-2021 16:50:40
:thumbsup:
Wolfgang Zenker - 23-11-2021 16:50:44
:clap::clap::clap::clap:
Christoph Berkemeier - 23-11-2021 16:50:58
:clap::clap::clap::clap:
Blake Willis - 23-11-2021 16:51:08
:clap::clap::clap:
Tom Hill - 23-11-2021 16:51:21
Anriette's microphone likely has its sensitivity turned-up a bit too far.
Maria Häll - 23-11-2021 16:51:23
Thx Anriette for the presentation!
Tom Hill - 23-11-2021 16:51:36
But we coped, thank you for reporting on the IGF :)
Chris Buckridge - 23-11-2021 16:52:52
this was the RIPE NCC's response to an earlier consultation on the Leadership Panel: https://www.ripe.net/participate/internet-governance/multi-stakeholder-engagement/ripe-ncc-response-to-the-consultation-on-paragraph-93.pdf
Chris Buckridge - 23-11-2021 16:53:13
(at the time referred to as a High-Level Mutlistakeholder Body, as Anriette noted)
Maria Häll - 23-11-2021 16:53:34
Thx Anriette and Chris!
Peter Koch - 23-11-2021 16:53:58
:clap:
Anriette Esterhuysen - 23-11-2021 16:54:01
https://www.intgovforum.org/en/content/igf-2021-registration
Desiree Miloshevic - 23-11-2021 16:55:27
Thank you Anriette!!
Mirjam Kühne - 23-11-2021 16:55:53
RIPE DB TF report is here: https://www.ripe.net/publications/docs/ripe-767
Brett Carr - 23-11-2021 16:56:09
should the slide be moving on?
Brett Carr - 23-11-2021 16:56:23
ignore me
Peter Hessler - 23-11-2021 17:00:43
LEA's *need* nothing. instead, they *desire* that information.
Mirjam Kühne - 23-11-2021 17:00:48
Thursday
Kurt Kayser - 23-11-2021 17:01:01
:clap::clap::clap::clap:
Chris Buckridge - 23-11-2021 17:01:09
Julf!!
Chris Buckridge - 23-11-2021 17:01:12
:)
Christoph Berkemeier - 23-11-2021 17:01:23
:clap::clap::clap::clap:
Julf Helsingius - 23-11-2021 17:01:24
Plugging USB cable in helps :)
Mirjam Kühne - 23-11-2021 17:01:29
Julf, we can see you :-)
Chris Buckridge - 23-11-2021 17:01:31
:sweat_smile:
Marco Hogewoning - 23-11-2021 17:01:37
That is it for today’s session, thank you all for attending. But, stay tuned!!! Starting at 17:30 CET is a Birds-of-a-Feather session discussing the Future of Technical Training, our colleagues from L&D would love to hear the community’s views on that.
Kurt Kayser - 23-11-2021 17:01:43
Yes, the transcribers are doing a great job!
Florian Streibelt - 23-11-2021 17:01:45
COFFEEE
Tahar Schaa - 23-11-2021 17:01:47
I miss time and posibility to disscus the society relevant issues here. NIS2 regulation has to be discussed in the community with open mic! RIPE meetings are loosing their grasroot democratic structure. Toooo bad!
Tom Hill - 23-11-2021 17:01:53
Coffeee :
Chris Buckridge - 23-11-2021 17:01:53
thanks you Co-Chairs!! And congrats Julf and Achilleas!
Brett Carr - 23-11-2021 17:01:59
bye and thanks all
Julf Helsingius - 23-11-2021 17:02:06
Thanks everybody!
Jahongir Jabborov - 23-11-2021 17:02:18
bye
Marco Hogewoning - 23-11-2021 17:02:19
all the slides are availavble on https://ripe83.ripe.net and so will be an archive of this chat and the transcript
Marco Hogewoning - 23-11-2021 17:02:29
bye for now
